British Muslims criticizing Sikhi

We're posting this conversation between a singh and a muslim bibi as it relates to our discussion topics from the past...important thing to note here is.. we are not trying to put islam down or anything of that sort..all we want is awareness in sikhs so that they are able defend themselves in an arguement.. another important point to note is that the debate was initiated by the muslim bibi herself not singh sahib..

Post Begins:

Pyare jio, due to rise of muslim students harrassing sikh kids in London andBradford in attempts of conversions. I will be putting up some old posts aboutconversations I have had with muslims, in the hope the young sikh kids can use these arguments to educate themselves, and counter questions on sikhi.

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

Pyare jio, recently I encountered a bibi who was heavily influenced by islam. She wanted to have a debate with me. She seemed quite confident she was goingto convince me about the superiority of Islam. I accepted. The angle she usedwas all about life after death.A few weeks later I was talking to another local Gursikh about this. He said this was so strange. He said in the office he worked, he too was approached,and also asked about life after death. He said not only this, but his brotherwho studies in a birmingham university was also asked the same questions. Sowas his sister, who is a teenager in a leeds school. We thought this cannot bea coincidnce that in the matter a two weeks four practicing sikhs areapproached by muslims with exactly the same questions. These are just thepeople we know, how many more? Wondering about this, we came to the conclusion, that there must be some kind of organised approach to this. Quite possibly an egroup, which regularly lists questions which can be asked to all non-muslims, to question their faith, and then interest them in islam.Two weeks ago, I met another sikh who works as a teacher in a school. He said he has alot of muslim kids in his class. He said one of them even came up to him, put his arm around him, and said, "give me half an hour, and I will convince you islam is the only way." He said he was amazed at the level of confidence in these kids that they could say something like that to their teacher.Below is the debate we had about this subject, initiated by the bibi.

Bibi: Bhaji, You sikhs believe in reincarnation. This is a completely absurdtheory. It does not make sense. How can a human then become a pig?

Das: Bhen ji, both sikhs and hindus believe in re-incarnation, but our belief isdifferent in some areas, but the whole concept of re-incarnation is not aboutwhat a person becomes in their next life, but about escaping the cycle of lifeand death and becoming mukht.

Bibi : But how do you become a pig from a human?Das: The body is just a vessel, only the soul is what is of value. This soul canbe born in any vessel.

Bibi: I do not accept this, I think it is absurd.
Das: Bhen ji, that is your choice. A person after death is judged according totheir thoughts & actions. It is according to this judgement, that they arehonoured or dishonoured in the next life. But even this is not so important. The important thing is to be able to break the cycle in life and death, whilealive. To be able to attain a spiritual plain and obtain mukhti. Then it doesnot matter what you will be in the next life, for you are free and merged withGod. That is the key to re-incarnation, that one breaks free from this cycle.

Bibi: Fine, but is sikhi the way? Judgement day will come upon us all.

Das: Yes it will, and it happens everyday. Everyday we are judged, and everyaction we do has a re-action. But in the end to Judgement day will come, wecall it the Dharam Raj, you call it different.

Bibi: No, judgement day will come to everyone on this earth. The day will bebeckoning, when Allah judges all, and the muslims will rise.

Das: You mean the muslims will rise, ie. all the ones buried in coffins willrise again and you will have an army of zombies fighting against non-muslims.You find re-incarnation absurd, but you find this acceptable?

Bibi: Islam is the truth, it is the only way. All those who are non-muslims willbecome muslims.

Das: Judgement day as a concept is complete nonsense. It does not make sense.

Bibi: How can you say that?

Das: Bhen ji, relax and listen. Firstly you believe in a day. Why? God, Allah,Waheguru, does not believe in day and night, God is timeless. Day and night isa concept of man, and the result of the earth circling the sun. Why would Godwait for a day to judge everyone. God is beyond that. It is a continuousprocess as in sikhi has with the Dharam raj. Do you believe God is not capableof judging people continuously. Why wait for a day? Them muslims who diedcenturies ago are then unlucky for they have had to stay in coffins all thistime, decomposing, waiting for this day to come when they can be judged. Doesthis not seem an ineffective way, surely continuous judgement via dhram raj ismore sensible, and God`s way is Truth. I see more truth in continuousjudgement.

Bibi: yes, but your way, turns a human into a pig?

Das: Bhen ji, You are stuck on one silly point. God gives his beloved souls manymany chances, it is they who choose whether to take this chance or not. If theydo not then they come back in some form or another. Just because muslims do notlike pigs, does not mean they are bad. A pig is part of Allah`s creation aswell,just like everything else. A person who is a friend of God, is also a friend onhis creation. That person learns to love and appreciate everything God hascreated.

Bibi: No, in islam there is only one chance, there is only one way, and you arejudged according to it.

Das: How can this be the way of God? Even a mother with a child. The child as itgrows up makes thousands of mistakes, the mother sometimes gets frustrated, butnever stops loving the child. The mother always forgives and has thatcompassionate nature. And we are talking of God. It is God who put thatcompassionate nature into the mother. How can we say God is not compasionate atall? The human will make thousands of mistakes in their life, no matter how holythey are, but God will always love them, help them, and be compassionate towards them. he gives them thousands of chances.

Bibi: Yes, true a mother is compassonate and so must be God. l have to readdeeper, maybe in islam you do get another chance.

Das: Then if you do get another chance, then that chance has a form. Whether ornot you accept it, then that is a form of re-incarnation, and non-acceptance ofJudgement day theory.

(Bibi goes quiet, revelation suddenly dawns upon her)

Bibi: No, No, I will have to get back to you ... We will talk about this again..Bibi left.


Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

Source: http://forums.waheguroo.com/index.php?showtopic=13507

THE COUNTDOWN BEGINS.....

The time for Sikh Awarenss Day is slowly approaching and your sevadaars from WesternSSA and COSS are currently working on arranging....



Gatka Performances By Shaheed Baba Deep Singh Gatka Akhara on Concrete Beach at 12:30pm and 1:30pm


Click On Picture For Informational Posters Available For Purchase Online

An Interactive Exibhit in UCC Atrium, with informational, artistic and historical displays from 10-4pm


The Showing of The Movie "Waterborne" in UCC Council of Chambers, along with a Guest Speaker and Discussion from 7-10pm

WSSA EXEC for 06/07!!

Thank you to all those who came out to vote this week- in this case especially, The election process ran smoothly. There were a few candidates who were added to the election process during the meeting. The election race was extremely close (seriously, we are not just saying that to make individuals feel better) and congratulations to all those who won.

Internal/External Communications (1)
Amneet Singh

Web and Design Coordinator (1)
Ishpreet Singh

Treasurer (1)
Ravimohinder Singh

Meeting Coordinators (2)
Amarjot Singh
Raviraj Singh

Events Coordinators (2)
Hamreen Kaur
Pawandeep Kaur

Candidates

The nomination deadline has passed, therefore we can now show who the candidates for elections are. The brackets indicate how many individuals are needed for the specific position.

There were some last minute changes in the candidates. Some people decided that they wanted to run and notified us at the meeting.

Internal/External Communications (1)

1. Amneet Singh
   

Web and Design Coordinator (1)

1. Ishpreet Singh

Treasurer (1)

1. Ravandeep Kaur
2. Ravimohinder Singh

Meeting Coordinators (2)

1. Amarjot Singh
2. Raviraj Singh

Events Coordinators (2)

1. Hamreen Kaur
2. Simran Singh
3. Pawandeep Kaur
4. Jasraj Singh (a new candidate)
5. Daljeet Singh (decided to run for events instead of meeting)

Elections and Waterloo Keertan Update

On Monday, February 20th The Western Sikh Students Association will be holding elections for the 2006 Executive Committee. If you are interested in running please email us by midnight on Sunday. In that email please, include your name, number and the position you would like to run for. For those that plan to run please be ready to do a very short speech on why you feel you are the best candidate and be prepared to be answer any questions put forth by members and previous execs.For further details, please check your emails.

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The time for The Waterloo Youth Keertan Darbar is approaching again. This round The Keertan will fall on the weekend going into reading week, therefore we are looking to find out how many members are interested in going. If we have a large amount of members wanting to attend the keertan and then go home to Toronto, we will try to arrange rides from London to Waterloo and then to Toronto. However, we must find out quickly how many individuals are willing to go and if they would like to return to London or continue to Toronto. We ask members to email us back ASAP and no later than by Sunday Night, with all the requested information along with name and phone number. This will give us sufficient time to arrange transportation and look at costs.

Please view flyer for more details

Trying Something New..Leave Some Feedback!

We tried a new flash slideshow for displaying our pictures on this blog. However, due to technical issues it can no longer be displayed.

If You Would Like To See Pictures From The Keertan @ Ajeets Home and Our Guest Speaker Lecture Please Visit Our Picture Gallery at www.westernssa.com

The Role of Women in Sikh History

Throughout history women have been known to have a key role in defining religion and Sikhism is no exception. In the Sikh history ,there have existed women who have given birth to prophets, had to adorn themselves with necklaces of their innocent children’s limbs, restore the passion for their Guru back into men and lead wars for them. These women deserve no less recognition than the men in Sikh history particularly due to the fact that both women and men are given equal status.

In this week's discussion, we were fortunate enough to have uncle ji Sardar Harkinder Singh come and share his knowledge not just about Sikh Women but about his past experiences and bani . Bhai Sahib is a local London High School teacher and has lectured about Sikhism at The University of Western Ontario in the past.

From woman, man is born;within woman, man is conceived; to woman he is engaged and married. Woman becomes his friend; through woman, the future generations come. When his woman dies, he seeks another woman; to woman he is bound. So why call her bad? From her, kings are born. From woman, woman is born; without woman, there would be no one at all.
Guru Nanak, Raag Aasaa Mehla 1, Page 473
**(taken from http://allaboutsikhs.com/women/index.htm)

Many women considered as Brahm Giyanees (saints)

The reason why we don’t know as much about them is due to the mistake made my all those in that time who failed to document such women.

The words from Gurbani say there is only one male in this world and everyone else in this world is female. “Iss jag main …..”

Everyone in the world in one form or another is woman and the only male is God himself.

Gurbani tries to infuse in the mind of the seeker that we should always attach ourselves with God

At a metaphysical level- There is no distinction between man and woman( all are one

Since we have lived under the influence of other cultures, females have been looked down upon, our culture celebrates the birth of a boy etc. ( This is the failure of society

Emotional passion and desire to love Sikhi much of the time comes from the woman

The power of listening to Gurbani from the mother has played a major role in Sikhi

The most significant contributions made by women come after Guru Gobind Singh ji when so many atrocities were being committed by the Moghuls. That was when the new generation were being brought up by the women

During the beginning of the 18th century, the women who sacrificed their children, etc never lost faith in the Gurbani and the Guru and in fact, this strengthened the faith of the children

Arguments:

Why can’t women be part of the Panj Pyarey? How do you justify that? How can we become a Global/worldly religion if we discriminate against these things?

There are leaders who say that women cannot participate in such things( If we have leaders like these, how are we supposed to progress as a religion?

Rebuttal:

Apparently, there are cases of women being part of the Panj Pyaray

This is something that shouldn’t be used as a grounds to test equality.

The background on Panj Pyarey, Guru Gobind Singh is considered “Mard Akamra”( Panj Pyaray are personifying the Guru Granth Sahib who is and has always been male

We hold Bhai Nand Laals Bani in very high esteem- He has said Panj Singh Amrit jo Deveh( basicaaly we must make the assumption that the Panj Pyarey will be male.

The women who have taken amrit, they wouldn’t necessarily insist on becoming a Panj Pyarey( it would be a question of ego

During that time in India, women really did not have any rights to begin with- its not like Guru ji didn’t give females the chance. Guru ji didn’t discriminate among people-( it is the way he wanted it and it is the way he should be accepted.

Its not a big issue, if you have love for the Guru then you won’t assert your rights like that

Even for example when we look at things like washing the walkways at the Golden Temple, if a woman wants to do it, it creates a big “ruckus.”

For example, we can even look at the laavan- the man leads and then the women follows(can we not make an issue out of that as well?

Ultimately, it is about self actualization- the body is like the Harimandar

It is a tradition- if it is tradition then it is not religion

These things happen but no one ever had any objections towards that

Its not as major an issue that it is being made out to be, if you have love for the Guru then you won’t assert your rights like that

Questions Raised:

In today’s society when we go to the Gurudwara, we see women and men sitting separately, could it be alright to get rid of that and have men and women sit together?

It is more of a cultural issue

All the leaders in our past who have been emphasized are male, why didn’t we emphasize the female leaders?

If we read history, there are many women by why aren’t they mentioned?

Guru Sahib has left no doubt that we should not distinguish anyone as being male or female, but as being a human

Why should we consider the woman who gave birth to Kings as less of a person?

In Reference to the Issue of Women becoming part of the Panj Pyarey

But then doesn’t it become a question of ego when men assume that they can only take on this role?

Isn’t Sikhi about seeking justice? Why shouldn’t those women be allowed to have that right?

If we are still not free people, how can we fight for others?

Notable Points:

In Sikhi, there is no man or woman- in the end the body is of no value and it is all about the mind.

No matter how depressed we are or how much trouble we are in, we always turn to Bani in the end

Uncle ji’s Choice of topic:

Always finds himself that in his destiny he has come across some interesting people in his life who has helped him to grow

The depth that good Sangat brings to us is described in Bani as being something that brings us the most grace ( our total mental state is changed and influenced by Sangat

At first, uncle ji did not have much interest in Bani but then believes himself to be fortunate to encounter those who were more learned

For uncle ji, when he comes across Bani, everyday there is a new meaning and he finds it to be an eye-opener

Words of advice: Never be judgemental about things ( Guru Sahib helps us understand Bani

We should spend as much time as possible on Gurbani ( there are times when it may look ritualistic from the outside but in essence, it has a very deep impact upon us

A Shabad from the Dasam Granth( written in a time of peace

Uncle ji shared a Shabad from the Dasam Granth with you which was written during the time of peace. He wanted to emphasize the beauty of the language in our Bani and the fact that we have so many resources to go to for the betterment of ourselves

ਛਤ੍ਰਧਾਰੀ ਛਤ੍ਰੀਪਤਿ ਛੈਲ ਰੂਪ ਛਿਤ ਨਾਥ ਛੌਣੀ ਕਰ ਛਾਇਆ ਬਰ ਛਤ੍ਰੀਪਤਿ ਗਾਈਐ ॥
He is sung as the canopied monarch, the Lord of canopies, a winsome entity, the Master and Creator of the earth and the superb support.

ਬਿਸੁਨਾਥ ਬਿਸ੍ਵੰਭਰ ਬੇਦ ਨਾਥ ਬਾਲਾ ਕਰ ਬਾਜੀਗਰਿ ਬਾਨ ਧਾਰੀ ਬੰਧਨ ਬਤਾਈਐ ॥
He is the Lord Sustainer of the Universe, Master of Vedas depicted as Lord having discipline.

ਨਿਉਲੀ ਕਰਮ ਦੂਧਾਧਾਰੀ ਬਿਦਿਆਧਰ ਬ੍ਰਹਮਚਾਰੀ ਧਿਆਨ ਕੋ ਲਗਾਵੈ ਨੈਕ ਧਿਆਨ ਹੂੰ ਨ ਪਾਈਐ ॥
The Yogis performing Neoli Karma (cleansing of intestines), those subsisting only on milk, learned and celibates, all meditate upon Him, but without an iota of getting His comprehension.

ਰਾਜਨ ਕੇ ਰਾਜਾ ਮਹਾਰਾਜਨ ਕੇ ਮਹਾਰਾਜਾ ਐਸੋ ਰਾਜ ਛੋਡਿ ਅਉਰ ਦੂਜਾ ਕਉਨ ਧਿਆਈਐ ॥੩॥੪੨॥
He is the king of kings and emperor of emperors, Who else should be meditated upon, forsaking such a Supreme monarch.3.42.

Guru Sahib is basically describing all of the qualities of Waheguru

It is the power of Guru’s words

Guru Sahib is telling us how to get rid of ego: Akal Purakh is the King of Kings, you must forget everything else and only remember him

Weekend Keertan @ Rajbir and Ajeet's

So, the keertan at Ajeet's house was a success! Good keertan, good sangat, good langar and good times! While doing keertan, Bhai Sahib Harkinder Singh Ji's translations were phenomonal and very simple, he even managed to relate the bani to valentines day for us uni kids (that's skills). The youth also participated on all levels with their sewa in langar, keertan, ardaas, etc.

However, after us uni kids ate some langar, we felt a sudden boost of energy. The boost in energy gave rise to 3 seperate missions...

Objective #1 -

Take digital camera pictures of Ajeet's family photos (the ones that were hanging so temptingly on the walls of the home they so graciously invited us into).

Objective #2 -

Add to the famous photo collection of Satwant Bhenji called "What Is Bhenji Eating Today?"

Objective #3 -

Stock up on sabji and langar for as long as possible (uni students)

Objective #4 -

Beat Gupreet Singh in video games


Although, missions 1, 2 and 3 were completed with a clear and decisive victory by Lubna, Ravan and Pawan taking home a good amount of langar, Gurpreet Singh remains the King of video game world, this time defeating the cute Ajeet Singh....Why cute? Well, check out proof of completion for objective 1.

PROOF OF COMPLETION

Objective 1

Objective 2

More pictures to be updated soon in www.westernssa.com picture gallery

WesternSSA and SikhSangat True Unity

At the beginning of the year WesternSSA and SikhSangat entered a partnership in the promotion of Sikhi to the masses of youth. Since then the partnership has only flourished. For example, when WesternSSA launched its website www.westernssa.com it immediatley linked SikhSangat as its official forum, Sikhsangat reciprocated the love by graciously promoting our events, and entertaining many of our genuine questions, concerns, and suggestions in Sikhi based discussions. The recent appearance of a blogpost from WesternSSA on SikhSangat.Org has only taken this partnership to another level. We would like to thank Sikhsangat for their continuous support in helping us as a Sikh Student Association grow with each and every day. If you would like to see the great sewa taken by sikhsangat please visit their News Site at www.sikhsangat.org or forums at www.sikhsangat.com

To see the recent appearence of our blog on Sikhsangat News please visit sikhsangat.org or click on the following pictures.

Sir Jave Ta Jave Mera Sikhi Sidhak Na Jave

February 12th, marks the day The Khalsa Panth birthed one of its most charismatic Sikh leaders. Sant Baba Jarnail Singh Bhindranwale often referred to as The Greatest Sikh of the 20th Centry was born on this day. Sant Ji, in his later years became Jathedar of Damdami Taksal and through his inspirational and hard work created a movement in which the entire world became conscious of the Sikh identity. We thank, Sant Baba Jarnail Singh Bhindranwale, and all Shaheeds of the Khalsa Panth for their sacrifice and work in solidifying the foundations of The Khalsa Panth, for the future generations of Sikh Youth.

A Message From OCSSA

Just to let everyone know that OCSSA will be having its first general meeting on Thursday, Feb 9th. It'll be held in Fauteux hall, Room 135. We only have the room till 7:30 so please be there by 5:30 pm. We'll be taking about Sikh day, electing a first year rep etc.

There's also free food. Please forward this email to any Sikh friends you know, and anybody else who's interested in joining OCSSA.

Free Yourself From Exam Stress! Langar and Keertan

WSSA would like to inform its members about a Keertan and Langar that will be taking place at Ajeet's house this Saturday (For those that are not familiar with Ajeet, he is a local high school student that regulary attends WSSA events and meetings). The keertan is being specifically held by Ajeet's family for the youth (uni students) so it would be greatly appreciated if you would come out. There will be langar available to all those that come and there will be time given to anybody who wants to do keertan.

The keertan will be held on Saturday February 11, 2006 and will commence at 4:00 p.m. and go till about 7:00 p.m. The location of the keertan is 641 Tennent Ave, which is approximately a 5min drive from uwo campus. Therefore, there will be the convenience of WSSA being able to bring and drop students off as they wish, although we encourage students to spend as much time at the keertan as they can.

For more details, ride requests or questions, please email us or Ajeet Singh at

westernssa@gmail.com
or
ajeet_s_13@hotmail.com
(519)667-2190

The Usage of Sikh Religious Symbols to Lure and Eventually Convert Sikh Girls

An issue that is becoming increasingly apparent in the U.K. and even some Canadian cities is that there are Muslim youth wearing the a Sikh article of faith known as the Kara to lure Sikh girls into relationships and eventually marriages with the intention of converting their religions. This week, this rising issue was discussed and possible solutions/conclusions were made. This discussion was very powerful and raised several very notable points worth pondering.

****If you are reading this blog and have opinions of your own to contribute, feel free to respond.

Opinions:

• Sikh girls shouldn't be going out with Muslim guys in the first place. It is as if they are choosing to mess with fire and so deciding to get burnt.
• If there is a Muslim individual who is wearing a Kara (with the wrong intentions), a Sikh individual should be able to approach them and ask to take it off.
• asfasf

Questions Raised:

• How is it possible to identify a Muslim guy wearing a Kara? If you did know that the individual wearing the Kara was Muslim, what action should you take upon finding out?
• How can we prevent this problem from igniting in Canada?
• Are we still at war with the Muslims?
• Does it even matter that individuals, namely young women, are converting?
• If these young women claim to be in love with the individuals, what are they going to choose-religion or the person with whom they are in love with?

Possible Answers:

• Don't allow yourself to become so assimilated into the Western culture
• Increase your knowledge about Sikhism. Don't allow someone belonging to another faith tell you false information, if any information at all about your religion.
• If the Muslim individuals are trying to convert us, then yes, we certainly have a problem with those individuals and must take some sort of action towards stopping them.

On Being a Good Sikh

Questions Raised:

• Why is it that girls are not as involved in Sikhi as guys? We are seeing an increasing number of males becoming passionate about their faiths, what is turning girls away?
• Do we have the obligation as fellow Sikhs to assist those who are straying away from Sikhi?

Important Points:

• We need to realize that there is a difference between being Sikh versus being Punjabi
• Parents don't seem to be setting a very good example to begin with.
• No one is born a Sikh, it is all about learning the principles. Just being born is not going to carry an individual far if they were to be in a situation where they can easily be swayed in one direction.
• Without knowledge, it is easy to waver anyone
• As Sikhs, we need to show that we are there for individuals who are straying away and have resources availible demonstrating that we have not turned our backs.
• As oppose to asking other Muslim individuals regarding conversions of other religious groups, it would be best to go to the direct source and refer to the Qu'ran itself.
• If you hold Sikhi dear to your heart, there is no question, let alone issue of converting/being converted.

Other Notable Questions Raised and Points to Think About:

• "Rehit Piaaree Mujh Ko, Sikh Piaaraa Naahee" --> Translation: It is not a Sikh who is dear to me, it is their rehit (the way they lead their life) that holds dear to my heart.-Guru Gobind Singh Ji
• You cannot claim to be a Sikh on the inside and act another way on the outside. What are your telling you and those around you?
• We seem to be mixing up a Singh and a Sikh. Are they the same thing?

-Sikh and Khalsa are the same thing. Although the first and tenth Gurus set out different principles, the same jot (spirit) was within all of them, so whatever the first Guru has said and whatever the tenth Guru added on to that should be collectively followed

• We are continuing to put the blame on the adults/parents in Sikhism however, we as youth are not doing a very good job ourselves. There are still numerous unnecessary conflicts and divisions among us.

Closing Remarks (Gurpreet Singh's Final Thoughts): "The key [to all of this] is becoming a better Sikh"

Pictures From Meetings

Here's a quick glimpse at some pictures from the last 3 meetings! Once we see some more activity from our visitors on the blog (hint..hint...leave some comments!) Maybe we'll start posting more pictures...

Meeting On Pakistani Youth Using Sikh Religious Symbols To Pick-Up Sikh Girls

Gagan Moderating Our Meeting While We Discuss Scenarios In Which Sikh's May Be Required To Remove Hair

Group Picture Of Those That Stuck Around Until The Very End Of Our Caste System Discussion

Meeting, Elections and Constitution

February 6th meeting will be a busy one. We will be speaking about the upcoming elections to be held at the end of the month, voting on amendments to the consitution and proceeding with our weekly discussion.

This weeks 2 available topics for discussion are....

1. How do we deal with the recent wave of Pakistani males using Sikh Articles of Faith to lure Sikh Girls.
2. Sikh women and equality - How Does Feminism Play a Role In Sikhi?
   

The meeting location will be the same as always. Kresgie 208 from 7-9pm, See You There!

Sikhi and Health

There are always instances where a difficult decision needs to be made- a difficult decision where an indivual's values can be put on the line and the individual has to judge which decision would be for the greater good. In Sikhi, one of the critical issues that we face is deals with hair removal and what we should do when we are put in a situation where the removal of hair will be inevitable. This week, the issue dealing with the importance of hair and whether the Sikh values can be bent in certain situations was discussed.


Arguments For:
o Making such a decision is personal choice
o If it is related to medical purposes, making the decision of hair removal makes sense and is something that is just logical
o Everything happens for a reason- it is God’s will
o It is easy to say one thing, but you never know what will happen until you are put in the situation
o Sikhi is a progression- if you are stopped along the way, that shouldn’t give you a reason to be punished by God.
o
Arguments Against:
In the Sikh history, Singhs have sacrificed their lives for hair so perhaps it’s a bigger deal than we think.
People are being cured from cancer and aids within hours from verses in the Guru Granth Sahib so is surgery even required?
In medical school what Bhagat Kabir has said is being studied so medicine itself is beginning to rely on faith for cures.
Most of the time, people who say things in defence of hair removal of any sort are just using it as an excuse


Questions raised:
o What if the person is unconscious and has no way of contacting parents and their hair needs to be removed? Then what do you do?
o As Sikhs, if you are being kept alive and your hair is removed which is a basic principle in the religion aren’t you removing your cause of being by doing that?
o In reference to the argument of such an occurrence being God’s will, how do you know it was God’s choice or free will?
o What about taking in drugs like marijuana for reducing pain? Isn’t that wrong as well?
o You can say that its all Waheguru’s hukum- but how far do you take it?
o How much do we follow Gurbani in general since we are always using it in reference to certain issues.

· Important points:
o Our parents had to face much worse situations about having a different appearance in this western world-so we shouldn’t really even be complaining about anything.
o If you are going against bani, you are going against the Guru’s hukum.
o None of us when our “time” is coming and how far we are going to go
o In life, failures come and go but you need to be able to accept them and move on- its all about the intentions
o We are all humans and have shortcomings. Certain circumstances arise where you must make a difficult decision.
o We have the tendency just to focus on physical health whereas we should be putting equal emphasis on mental health as well.

And the tangent discussion: Sikh girls and the removal of hair to raise self-esteem

· Question Raised: What if a girl who does her eyebrows is/decides to be amritdhari? What happens then?

· Arguments for:
o Self-esteem for a girl is a major issue
o Can a girl not be as good a Sikh even if she does a little bit of hair removal to feel better about herself?
o In society, its alright for guys to have facial hair, but if a girl has any excessive amounts its generally unacceptable
o Aren’t there other qualities that we should focus as equally upon but tend to neglect because this one overshadows them all?
o Besides, judging goes against the Sikh values so opinions must be put aside/

· Arguments Against:
o Girls need to be able to support each other so that they can feel comfortable about themselvesà They need to build a foundation for themselves.
o Yes self-esteem is an issue, but the girl needs to get over it.
o When it comes down to the basics, you are a Sikh if bani says so

· Important Points:
o When it comes to religion, you don’t just have to work on yourself from the outside in, it can also be from the inside out, sort of like a catalyst and gives you more of an obligation to follow that path anyways
o It is a Sikh’s duty to teach other Sikhs what they can

Akhand Jaap

Waterloo Youth Keertan Darbar

With Guru Ji's Kirpa...

The University of Waterloo Sikh Students Association

Will Be Holding a

Youth Keertan Darbar

WHEN

Saturday February 25th, 2006

LOCATION

Kitchener Gurughar
2070 Synder Road East

TRANSPORTATION

Transportation will be provided from The Waterloo Campus

Also...

A Bus will be arranged from Dixie Gurughar To Kitchener

CONTACT

For More Information Please Contact You Local SSA

UWO - Westernssa@gmail.com
Waterloo - Uwssa@yahoo.com